Comments on: The Best Espresso Machine https://coffeegeek.com/opinions/state-of-coffee/the-best-espresso-machine/ The World's Most Read Coffee and Espresso Resource Mon, 12 Aug 2024 21:49:57 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=6.9 By: Mark Prince https://coffeegeek.com/opinions/state-of-coffee/the-best-espresso-machine/#comment-714 Sun, 02 Jun 2024 05:54:12 +0000 https://coffeegeek.com/?p=51706#comment-714 In reply to David S.

A couple of notes.

First, Lelit is now owned by Breville, but they are still built, designed and entirely managed by the same team and company that they have been for 20 years; and their machines’ reps are pretty solid. So I feel really comfortable recommending them. The fact they are being moved over to Baratza’s after sales support team starting in 2024 was the kicker.

Second, I have a Dual Boiler BES800 model from 2012 that is still functional today and has, according it its service menu, 8200 shots pulled on it. I have had to replace some gaskets on the steam boiler, and replace the pump once. For most of its life, I have used filtered water with it. Replacing gaskets is fairly trivial, even for those who are uncomfortable with removing the main body panels and diving into the machine. It’s no where near as difficult as doing, say a heating coil replacement in one of the boilers. Most of the “leaks” you find in most espresso machines come from these gaskets. I’ve had to do the same kind of work on long-used Rancilio Silvias, my La Marzocco GS3, the Speedster, two different Gaggia Classics, a Profitec 400, and several other machines. This isn’t an exclusive issue with Breville machines.

Third, I have a BES820 model from 2016 that we use as our lab test machine, and that has 714 on the shot marker, which means it has pulled 7140-7150 shots. I have replaced gaskets on the steam boiler’s probes twice on that one, and the grouphead gasket twice. It has used filtered water its entire life.

A good friend of mine in Ottawa has a BES820 that had leak problems starting about 2 years after he started using it. Got it serviced. Leak problems showed up again about 18 months later. We had a lot of back and forth (because I recommended the machine to him) and finally figured out he wasn’t using the water filter included, or better filtered water afterwards. Where he’s at, the water is particularly hard. The water he used ended up shortening the life of his machine and the parts. I pulled a few strings, and he got a good service deal on the machine (I don’t want to go into too many details) but he has used filtered water ever since (the BWT system). In four years since, his machine hasn’t had any leak problems or other issues.

So my main question to you is, were you using filtered water? Because Breville sells literally 100s of thousands of these machines every year, and their return rates are, last I looked into this (around 2019) are lower than the high end industry average. They have been actively working since 2014 or so to improve their parts service, and after sales service (getting an Oracle Touch for $750 is a pretty amazing deal, all things considered that is below their US delivered cost). Their improved after sales service is another reason why I said the Bambino Plus is a serious machine to consider.

For you to have every one of your Breville machines fail seems an outlier, and possibly a user-end issue, not problems with the Breville machines themselves. Be totally honest: what’s your local water supply like, and were you religious about using 100% filtered water (or even better, water designed to prevent scale build up, like BWT’s systems).

I don’t do enough in our past reviews to absolutely stress the importance of good, filtered water for espresso machines. (I plan on changing this). Think about what they go through, compared to an auto drip machine or a kettle, or any other water heating device for coffee brewing. Espresso machines go through literal torture compared to those other devices, and bad water will definitely shorten their lifespans.

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By: David S https://coffeegeek.com/opinions/state-of-coffee/the-best-espresso-machine/#comment-713 Sat, 01 Jun 2024 22:21:24 +0000 https://coffeegeek.com/?p=51706#comment-713 Interesting that both your top machines are Breville brands. I’ve owned two Brevilles – their original dual boiler machine (paired with a Compak K3 grinder), and currently an Oracle Touch. Both machines have been unreliable money pits. The dual boiler machine (I actually had two as the first didn’t work when I received it, so Breville replaced it) had multiple leak problems over the 4 years I had it and Breville stopped servicing those machines. So they offered me a good discount on the Oracle Touch. I spent ~$750 on the Touch last year because of internal leaks and bad solenoids causing the thing to go crazy even when turned off, and now it’s broken again with similar sounding issues (I’m not a tech type guy and wouldn’t dream of taking it apart to see what’s wrong). I’m currently waiting for the box to ship it back to Breville for a repair quote. And to be fair, Breville’s customer service has been good. But I do worry about the reliability of everything Breville.
Now, if the Bambino Plus has a problem after a few years, I guess it’s cheap enough to just get a new one. But that’s contributing to the throw-away society we’ve become, which seems wrong.

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By: Mark Prince https://coffeegeek.com/opinions/state-of-coffee/the-best-espresso-machine/#comment-549 Mon, 20 May 2024 09:14:27 +0000 https://coffeegeek.com/?p=51706#comment-549 In reply to kim martin.

The 54mm portafilter is the least issue amongst those you’ve listed; a really good grinder, even the Encore ESP, SK40 Turin, DF54 or DF64Gen2 and the Lagom Mini for sure will vastly improve the espresso a Bambino Plus will produce. I’d concentrate on a) a good grinder, b) using good filtered water, c) sourcing good coffee, then work on your skills.

The 54mm portafilter can hold up to 18g in the basket, which is more than enough for a nice 45-50g double shot that is well balanced and tasty.

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By: kim martin https://coffeegeek.com/opinions/state-of-coffee/the-best-espresso-machine/#comment-525 Sun, 19 May 2024 01:37:55 +0000 https://coffeegeek.com/?p=51706#comment-525 Thank you so much Mark for this very informative article. Wondering if you would investigate how to improve the flavour factor (looking for richness/body) with the bambino plus. I had no idea where to start with espresso and bought a delonghi but was not happy with lack luster flavour (i’m used to turkish grind with stove top bialetti).

You are so right about BP’s excellent features but i’m wondering if is, in part, because portafilter is 54 mm as opposed to standard 58mm of more expensive/commercial machines? I’m thinking to buy baratza sette 270 as it is on sale. Have been using blade grinder shaking it as it is grinding and i am getting a consistant med fine grain( i have backed off from fineness so time of shot is ~ 25 sec and I pick out any larger uneven bits. I was also thinking of the mini lagom . I’m also trying to suss out machines 500 to 1300 with 58mm and can be serviced in vancouver bc.

Thanks again for providing an excellent website.

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By: Chris C. https://coffeegeek.com/opinions/state-of-coffee/the-best-espresso-machine/#comment-307 Tue, 30 Apr 2024 08:45:35 +0000 https://coffeegeek.com/?p=51706#comment-307 This is a very intriguing article. I especially like to focus on after sales service and support. I’ve long admired the La Marzocco GS3 from a distance, but learning the realities of owning such a bespoke, custom and hand built machine (and specifically the service costs) is a reality check. This article made me dive a bit into La Marzocco Home’s website, and I’m shocked at the prices they charge for various accessories and parts. I do hope your prediction that Lelit will become a lot more serious about after sales support, and the prices on parts and accessories comes true. I see Lelit is on a big sale right now. There may not be a Bianca in my future, but the might be a Victoria or Mara!

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